[Dev] people banned from irc for harrassment

Luke T. Shumaker lukeshu at sbcglobal.net
Thu Sep 5 00:58:33 GMT 2013

Just a quick bit about the notation I use:
 - All times are GMT
 - I will group direct quotes in "exhibits"
 - If I skip any posts in an exhibit, it will be indicated by "...",
   otherwise, an exhibit is the complete record for that timeblock.
 - Exhibits are numbered. If the number before the decimal point is
   the same, they are effectively one exhibit; no posts between them
   were skipped
 - I try to keep things in absolute order, but starting at exhibit 5,
   I thread the conversations by topic for easier discussion.

Gravi wrote:
> A day and a half ago, the not well-known user "taylanub" boastfully
> bursted in the chat, censoring some behaviours, and wanting to be
> treated like the very incarnation of Jesuschrist.

I've read the logs since taylanub first joined the channel (17:35
GMT).  I haven't seen him post anything boastful, arrogant, or

> Thanks to him, I discover some of my attributes: "childlike, rude,
> inappropriate and fool".
> Prior to that situation, icarious and me [Gravi] were quielty
> talking in the chat, and when the new one came, we greeted him
> cordially.

Not that it actually matters, icarious and taylanub were talking, when
*you* (Gravi) joined.

 * 17:34: taylanub first joins the channel
 * 20:32: icarious, taylanub, and Xylon are discuss programming
 * 20:52: Gravi joins, icarious greets him ("Gravy my boy"/"Hi,
          icarious... what's up, crypto-friend")
 * 20:53: Xylon leaves (becomes "Xylon_away")
 *      : icarious and Gravi discuss cryptography

> "taylanub" was offended with my particular and frequent use of the
> "xD" expression,

He merely commented on your frequent use of "xD":
(irrelevent posts removed)

Exhibit 1: taylanub comments on Gravi's use of "xD"
  [21:08] <taylanub> Gravi: Not to be rude but how old are you ? :P
  [21:08] <Gravi>    taylanub: Yeah, your a bit rude.
  [21:08] <taylanub> I just haven't seen someone use "xD" with such
                     high frequency lately ...

Besides a little innocent teasing about editors (Emacs/vim/IDEs),
nothing bad so far.

 * 21:14: GuestOne joins into the conversation

GuestOne's language is a little foul, but nothing hateful.

 * 21:26: Basstard` joins into the conversation
 * 21:27: icarious goes silent for a while

> so the fight was served in the moment we start talking about the
> best programming language for beginners.

Exhibit 2: taylanub comments on Gravi+GuestOne's immature behavior 
  [21:28] <taylanub> Do you also know the counter-arguments ?  Also,
                     if you know the argument of another person, you
                     should probably make it explicit that it's not
                     your own argument, lest you give people the
                     impression that you have had personal experience
                     to support the arguments. 
  [21:28] <Gravi> JAVA SUCKS.
  [21:29] <Gravi> Tayla, be careful... or you will be fucked by Guesty
                  and me in short time.
  [21:29] <Gravi> xD
  [21:29] <GuestOne> taylanub, you are sayng bullshit
  [21:29] <taylanub> Sure is mature in here ...
  [21:29] <Basstart`> taylanub: Indeed.
  [21:30] <GuestOne> i don't give a shit of you broken ass nerds
  [21:30] <taylanub> Seems to be two people, mainly.  I reckon when
                     this channel was kinda better.

 * 21:31: jxself joins into the conversation

> "taylanub" was offended once again with our nearly and ludicrous
> style of speech, so a crazy third member of the Triad (GuestOne)
> started to participate without any kind of known tact, and maybe
> with the inane intention of playing using the new words that day had
> learnt, so he lost control and started to say nonsense things
> (misogyny and sexist things) that weren't invited to the topic of
> the conversation.

Exhibit 3: GuestOne assumes that taylanub is female
  [21:32] <GuestOne> is Tayla a woman?

At this point, nothing has been said that would indicate taylanub's
gender.  To be fair, GuestOne assuming taylanub to be a woman is an
understandable/forgivable mistake ("Tayla" is usually a girl's name,
but that was a mistake; taylanub's first name is "Taylan").  This
assumption will be held by (at least) GuestOne and Gravi until 21:41
when taylanub clarifies that he is male.

Exhibit 4.1:
  [21:32] <taylanub> Ugh, seriously, who brought these two to Parabola ?
  [21:32] <GuestOne> eh?
  [21:32] <taylanub> Gravi: GuestOne: You should go right back to
  [21:33] <GuestOne> eh?
  [21:33] <jxself> They bring themselves, don't they? Via their IRC
  [21:33] <Gravi>: No, we're the two favourite trolls in this channel.
  [21:33] <taylanub> #archlinux-offtopic is full of people like you.
  [21:33] <Gravi> So don't get angry.


Exhibit 4.2:
  [21:33] <GuestOne> java is like you taylanub
  [21:33] <GuestOne> a fat nerd girl

  [21:33] <taylanub> I remember times where being a troll was separate
                     from being an asshole, nowadays people seem to
                     use the words as synonyms. 
  [21:33] <Gravi> hahahaha!
  [21:34] <Gravi> Guesty, love... say something to this crazy bitch.
  [21:34] <Gravi> xD
  [21:34] <Gravi> I can't handle her.
  [21:34] <GuestOne> and as a macho and maschilist and sexist MEN with
                     great virility and masculinity i will band you
                     from this channel
  [21:34] <GuestOne> with my roman sword
  [21:34] <Gravi> HAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!!

> "taylanub" was offended as well, so he threaten to report ourselves
> for a ban cause "the channel wasn't what he used to expect".

Exhibit 5: taylanub brings up mods/opperators/banning
  [21:35] <taylanub> jxself: Basstard`: icarious:  Does this channel have mods ?
  [21:35] <jxself> Let's all calm down now.
  [21:35] <Basstard`> It would be nice with operators in here. Not GuestOne or Gravi.
  [21:35] <icarious> taylanub: no. we just kiss and make up. and things flow smooth the next day
  [21:35] <icarious> :P
  [21:35] <Gravi> That's it.
  [21:36] <jxself> taylanub: If you do /msg chanserv access #parabola list then you can see... :)
  [21:36] <taylanub> Ah thanks.
  [21:37] <taylanub> aurelien: halp!
  [21:37] <GuestOne> halp
  [21:37] <taylanub> mtjm: Why don't you just ban these types of people ?
  [21:37] <GuestOne> mtjm is our friend

Note: this marks icarious re-joining the conversation.

 * 21:35: icarious resumes conversation

Exhibit 6: taylanub discusses the tone of the channel
  [21:36] <taylanub> icarious: This channel used to have a friendly
                     and somewhat professional tone, not the tone of
                     angry 16 year-old boys. 
  [21:36] <GuestOne> i'm friendly with machos like me
  [21:37] <icarious> taylanub: it depends from time to time. when its
                     idle. we do all troll around. But we are not the
                     "officy" types tying tie knots 24/7 :P
  [21:38] <taylanub> icarious: Nah, you can see #emacs for a channel
                     that's fun and crazy and still mature (for some
                     value of "mature").  The behavior of these two is
                     just .. totally distasteful.  
  [21:38] <icarious> taylanub: stay for a few days. You will like
                     it. out here , the first impression is not always
                     the last impression 
  [21:39] <jxself> It may be the last for some people...
  [21:39] <jxself> Hence it's good to be nice to people. :)
  [21:39] <Gravi> Icarious is right, we're enjoyable and very correct people...
  [21:39] <taylanub> icarious: I spent time with people like these two
                     for more than a year in #archlinux-offtopic and
                     its spin-off channels, I enjoyed it when I was
                     16-17 myself.
  [21:39] <taylanub> At some point I grew out of it.
  [21:40] <Gravi> Don't get nervous... I think you're a bit irritat{ed, ing} today.
  [21:40] <Gravi> Tomorrow is another day. Rest some hours.
  [21:40] <icarious> ,sunday
  [21:40] <pbot> sunday is: the day all trolls swarm to #parabola,
                 avoid at all cost to remain sane. 

Note that jxself (and Basstard` in exhibit 5) express that they do not
condone the behavior of Gravi and GuestOne, whereas icarious excuses
their behavior.

Shortly after, taylanub sent this private message to several
opperators of the channel:

Exhibit 7:
  [21:50] <taylanub> Based on the following logs I'd kindly urge you
          to discipline (and if it fails, and it probably will, just
          ban) Gravi and GuestOne on #parabola: http://sprunge.us/NJZG
          This message sent to you and a couple more OPs.  Sorry for
          being uptight, but that kind of behavior in your community
          is going to give a very bad name to such a lovely
          project. :)

> Some hours later (for me, the next morning), all things returned to
> normality. I was helping a user in the IRC and for the rest, the
> activity on the channel was relaxed.

This is not false.

> Suddenly, I got banned by fauno for "Allowing harassing" so icarious
> and GuestOne were for his reasons.

No, you (Gravi) and GuestOne were banned for actual harassing,
icarious was temporarily banned for allowing it.

 * 11:39: fauno bans GuestOne, Gravi, and temorarily icarious

The next morning, fauno banned GuestOne and Gravi, while giving
icarious a one-day ban.

> Hereby, I want to denounce fauno's behaviour for the causes:
>  * Authority excess
>  * Unilateral tyrant and deliberate decission taking.

Fauno is one of the longest and most active Parabola developers.  If
he doesn't have that authority, I don't know who does.  Further, he
he had the endorsement of jxself, Basstard`, and mtjm, based on
comments they made on the channel.

The only part of fauno's actions I dissagree with are the one-day ban
of icarious; I would have just discussed it with him/warned him.

>  * Dragging from the channel people ignoring consecuences for all
>    the community. 

That is quite possibly the funniest joke I've heard come from the
channel.  No one thinks more about the community than fauno.  He had
considered the consequences of both allowing and banning GuestOne.  In
private, we had previously discussed the negative consequences of
sexist (and other "*ist") comments.  While kicking someone out is bad,
the harm those comments do is worse.  Even if you disagree, it is
ignorant/stupid/arrogant to insist that fauno ignored anything.

>  * Prevent the affected parts to defend itselfs.
>  * Favor his favourite part without a proper trial or judge's
>    quality.
>  * Hypocrisy and violation of the foundations of the democratic
>    nature of the project.

Except that all of these things are false.  He made a post to the
mailing list explaining his actions, accepting the possiblity that he
over-reacted or over-stepped his bounds (despite my above
demonstration that he was well within his bounds), and inviting a
discussion about it from the community.  Bans are not written in
stone.  This mailing list is your oportunity to defend yourself.  This
mailing list is the trial.  If you are innocent, it is like a suspect
being in jail prior to trial.

> I demand the inmediate and irremisible actions to be done:
>  * Unban the users "GuestOne, Gravi and icarious"

icarious' ban was only one day.  I favor a probationary un-ban for
GuestOne and Gravi, given they promise to change their behavior.

>  * Start a conversation along with "taylanub" and "fauno" to achieve
>    an understanding and to present respects to all the implicates.

Do you not see this mailing list thread?  That's what this is.
However, as far as I'm concerned, nothing needs to be said from
taylanub, he was simply the one that was being picked on when fauno
decided that it had been enough.

>  * Punish fauno's negligent and abusive exercise of power, as long
>  * and promoting a new member to replace himself as the coordinator
>    of the IRC channel.

fauno has not done anything wrong, as I have explained, he acted
within his bounds.

Happy hacking,
~ Luke Shumaker

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