[Dev] *URGENT* Proposal to organise Parabola

Aurélien DESBRIÈRES aurelien at hackers.camp
Sun Dec 7 18:30:44 GMT 2014

hellekin <hellekin at gnu.org> writes:

> On 12/07/2014 02:35 PM, Aurélien DESBRIÈRES wrote:
>> Pour autant c'est parceque l'on cherche toujours à faire taire les plus
>> belles utopie plutôt que de se battre pour elles et trouver des
>> solutions à celle-ci, que les utopies n'avance pas alors quelle le
>> pourraient.
>> Alors lève toi et bat toi.
> *** Translation:
> Meanwhile, because the most beautiful utopias are forced into silence
> instead of called for being fought for, and thus find solutions for
> them, they don't work as they should.
> So, stand up and fight.
> *
> Again, I appreciate the position.  But you fail to respond to the
> question of money: do you live without money?

No but I but I do my best to reduce the bills.

> Do you realize that because every participant has to find money outside
> the project, the project itself depends on, at best and as fauno
> suggested, project-based services, and at worst, a day job, that the
> utopia is not working as it should?

I do as I can too.

> Meanwhile, non-free, corporate-based projects built on surveillance
> megabucks such as Internet.org, are progressing way faster, and leaving
> entire populations prisoners of proprietary and trade economy
> ideologies, while they could be working on solidarity-based solutions.
> I'd like to understand what you're calling for exactly, if that is
> simply to survive with what you have, or is it to make an utopia turn
> real.  In that case, instead of discourse, I'd like to read about how
> you propose to address the issue that is coming up, that people need to
> put food on their table, and they're having difficulties dealing with it
> from their current standpoint.
> According to the principle you're flying the flag of, impure money won't
> be touching the project.  Therefore, you're stifling solidarity by
> refusing a mean to sustain contributors.  If that is not the case, then
> please, explain how you envision working around the difficulty met by
> the people who proposed opening the project to receiving donations so
> that they can keep afloat while maintaining their current dedication,
> instead of being forced to drive their attention away from it.
> I'm all ears as to how to set up money-less solutions that empower
> people to contribute and reinforce not only the technology, but the
> community as well.  Otherwise I have to say BTDT: while some people
> dedicate their life to the project, others are simply contributing in
> their "free time", and the one-way route of the former ends to an impasse.
> Once again, the issue at stake is not money or not money--first prove me
> that you don't use it, and I can believe you--but what is meant by
> community, and solidarity, and how does that come into play at the level
> of a software project.  Is it considered a common pool resource where
> every contributor benefits from it to "fend for themselves", or is their
> something more than libertarian capitalist trade economy behind this?

Money represent many troubles.
- some will not join the project for the utopia, since the utopia will
not be anymore
- some will join the project for money only, the one for the utopia will
not come anymore since the utopia will not be anymore sinc you have
killed it
- some people will join the project for the power to control and get
more money and not for the utopia of the project since the utopia will
not be anymore since you have killed it

you kill the utopia and ask what is the trouble? hmm

"débarquer la bouche en coeur"

> ==
> hk
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