[Dev] people banned from irc for harrassment

[Luke T. Shumaker]

At Thu, 5 Sep 2013 22:33:43 +0530,
Icarious wrote:
> I have been silent on this issue over the developers mailing
> list. And I guess this is the time I will express my concerns.
> 
> lukeshu wrote:
> >The only part of fauno's actions I dissagree with are the one-day ban
> >of icarious; I would have just discussed it with him/warned him.
> 
> That's exactly how I wanted it to go and I have asked for a proper
> clarification. But that's best done "prior" to a ban and not after
> it.
> 
> As things got to this, that everyone is speaking clearly from their
> sides. I would like to clarify the consequences of this
> "Abrupt/without-discussion/warning" (one day) ban on me. One day or
> a minute, to be honest I am personally affected by this which I will
> discuss in the end. Firstly, I have always maintained a neutral
> stance on parabola without any personal favoritism "up until the
> ban" and always kept a friendly attribute with everybody.
> 
> lukeshu wrote:
> >Note that jxself (and Basstard` in exhibit 5) express that they do not
> >condone the behavior of Gravi and GuestOne, whereas icarious excuses
> >their behavior.
> 
> ... pbot ... "Steve-Ballmer/Bill Gates" ... "or for allowing
> it/laughing at it." as quoted by fauno ...

Having thoroughly reviewed the logs, you actually didn't "lol" at the
sexist comments or anything like that (this time anyway, if you did
other times, I don't know).  Following is the sum of everything
"incriminating" you said (again, this time) (with context included
where appropriate):

  [21:36] <taylanub> icarious: This channel used to have a friendly
                     and somewhat professional tone, not the tone of
                     angry 16 year-old boys. 
  ...
  [21:37] <icarious> taylanub: it depends from time to time. when its
                     idle. we do all troll around. But we are not the
                     "officy" types tying tie knots 24/7 :P
  ...
  [21:38] <taylanub> icarious: Nah, you can see #emacs for a channel
                     that's fun and crazy and still mature (for some
                     value of "mature").  The behavior of these two is
                     just .. totally distasteful.  
  [21:38] <icarious> taylanub: stay for a few days. You will like
                     it. out here , the first impression is not always
                     the last impression 
  ...
  [21:39] <taylanub> icarious: I spent time with people like these two
                     for more than a year in #archlinux-offtopic and
                     its spin-off channels, I enjoyed it when I was
                     16-17 myself.
  [21:39] <taylanub> At some point I grew out of it.
  [21:40] <Gravi> Don't get nervous... I think you're a bit
                  irritat{ed, ing} today. 
  [21:40] <Gravi> Tomorrow is another day. Rest some hours.
  [21:40] <icarious> ,sunday
  [21:40] <pbot> sunday is: the day all trolls swarm to #parabola,
                 avoid at all cost to remain sane. 
  ...
  [21:44] <icarious> I am know as the curry eater/ bollywood guy /
                     punjabi (not my province). and a lot of other
                     kicks. I don't mind it at all
  ...
  [21:45] <taylanub> icarious: That doesn't mean that others won't
                     mind it. :)
  ...
  [21:53] <taylanub> icarious: I'd recommend you not to associate
                     yourself with a "culture" such as that of Gravi
                     and GuestOne.  You might get used to it and not
                     mind it, but some other people inevitably will,
                     and once that happens you'll be contributing to
                     the discrimination of those people by tolerating
                     it.
  [21:53] <taylanub> Once one truly gets used to such behavior, one
                     can become very blinded against others' feelings,
                     thinking that oneself, they must not be minding
                     any insults, while they do.  There are many
                     people who end up killing themselves out of
                     Internet bullying, let alone real-life bullying.
                     A foolish thing to do perhaps, but that still
                     doesn't make it the victim's fault.

I included taylanub's response at the end, as it largely sums up
fauno's reason for banning you.  The punch-line is "you'll be
contributing to the discrimination of those people by tolerating it."

This is something most of us are guilty of, though.  jxself and
Basstard` spoke out against it when they saw it, but as I've
mentioned, I've basically just gone offline when I've seen it, which
is still "contributing ... by tolerating it."

I think that the effective difference is that you were still involved
in the conversation; even if you never commented on the comments, you
are effectively condoning it to an observer by being there but not
speaking against it.  Where, if I am silent, an observer does not know
that I am actually there, having read the comments.

I think the distinction is silly, but that's also why I think you
shouldn't have been banned.

> Lastly, there are two points that did hurt me in personal and I
> would like to clarify it today.
> 
> 1) fauno's unilateral ban without discussing and asking for an
>    explanation from me before coming to a decision.

That's a fair point.  I think fauno was fed up with at least GuestOne,
and probably Gravi too, and you just got dragged into it.

> 2) In accordance with the above Point 1), It saddens me to see the
>    consistent /topic of #parabola everyday which I take as a public
>    humiliation itself. Surely the developers would realize it
>    someday sooner.

At least the /topic doesn't directly mention you by name :)

For (future?) reference, the /topic is:

    people banned from irc for harrassment → https://lists.parabolagnulinux.org/pipermail/dev/2013-September/001801.html

----

Besides changing the /topic, what do you think would be fair
retribution/appology (to you, we will address GuestOne and Gravi in a
reply to your other email)?

Happy hacking,
~ Luke Shumaker